Erdtree seal vs dragon communion seal

InfestedAdam 8 months ago#1

Post 1.04 patch, Black Flame, Lightning Spear, Swarm of Flies, and Frenzied Burst are still my bread-n-butter incantations for most situations. I have 50 Faith and 50 Arcane. I might start pushing one or both to 80 as runes become available.

Dragon Communion is at +9. Everything else at +6 / +18. I use the Jellyfish Shield in my left-hand for the 20% damage buff.

Before I spend resources upgrading other seals to +9 / +24 (I do not have the late-game smithing stone bells yet), are the various +10-20% damage boost of other seals enough to make up for their lower scaling compared to the Dragon Communion? Assuming the Wiki is accurate, Dragon Communion can potentially have 415 scaling vs Godslayer's 329 at max upgrades / stats.

Comments and opinions are appreciated,

Thank you

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Saltyman 8 months ago#2

They didn't nerf Dragon Communion Seal directly, they nerfed the way Arcane scaling works on status buildup spells so it should still do the same damage just less status buildup on certain spells.

From what I can tell it takes 2-3 waves of Dragonice instead of 1 to inflict frostbite. Although Swarm of Flies does seem pretty bad now.. It takes way too many casts to bleed enemies with any sort of resistance, but on the other hand Bloodflame Talons, Bloodboon, and most Dragon Communion spells are a lot better now..

I would actually say Blood or Dragon Communion caster builds are significantly better than they were before the patch. I tested out some of the buffed Black Flame spells and Black Flame Tornado but they still kind of suck.. Black Flame (the fireball one) is broken but most of the other Godskin spells and Ashes of War are still awful.

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JetJenkins 8 months ago#3

Keep it. I have a 50/50 too and it still is my power house for what I use.

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king_wallace 8 months ago#4

You don't need to cast with a seal to get the buff, you just have to have it equipped.

If you aren't trying to stop leveling at a specific level, then this advice isn't really relevant, but at 50/50 you really don't need to be leveling for damage anymore. You'll get more scaling out of Erdtree at 80 faith sure, but is that worth the points? Not at all.

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InfestedAdam (Topic Creator)8 months ago#5

Thank you for the feedback regarding the Dragon Communion Seal and others.

king_wallace posted...

You don't need to cast with a seal to get the buff, you just have to have it equipped.

Does these other seals to be actively equipped in the other hand? Or simply in a hand slot? I usually prefer the Jellyfish Shield for the temporary 20% damage buff to all damage sources compared to the 10-20% pernament damage buff to certain spells. And the option to block should the need arises.

"You must gather your party before venturing forth"
"Go for the eyes Boo! Go for the eyes!"

king_wallace 8 months ago#6

It needs to be 'out', so actively in your other hand or on your back if you're 2h your casting seal for whatever reason.

If you're using jellyfish, then yeah you might get more damage using a different seal, but given your stat spread you probably won't. You can use an AR calculator to see what your spellbuff would be and then just multiply that by the passive boost % to see what your effective spellbuff would be.

https://eldenring.negator13.com/calculator

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MJR_Raikov 8 months ago#7

Saltyman posted...

Although Swarm of Flies does seem pretty bad now.. It takes way too many casts to bleed enemies with any sort of resistance

This is partially true, but alleviated by having max cast speed. I would argue that max cast speed is necessary to really make SoF worth using post-patch. Those few extra frames of cast animation means your flies won't overlap as quickly, and because every "instance" of bleed buildup was nerfed, every frame of overlap counts even more now and will be the difference between procing bleed in many fights.

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ninjaman44 8 months ago#8

Saltyman posted...

I tested out some of the buffed Black Flame spells and Black Flame Tornado but they still kind of suck.. Black Flame (the fireball one) is broken but most of the other Godskin spells and Ashes of War are still awful.

Disagree big time; I've played through most of the game using godslayer incantations. Black Flame ritual stops certain enemies in their tracks, and will melt large bosses as well. Scouring Black flame was a bit more situational, but pre-buff I used it to kill the Astel in the consecrated snowfield. Both have gotten buffed quite nicely with the current patch and should be even more useful.