 Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV Jul 23, 2021 Hi, I've gotten some great feedback on the Sony forum. I am upgrading from m43 and have narrowed it down to the R5 and A7RIV. I actually think I would be happy with either, but there are a few aspects of each that appeal to me. I shoot mostly landscape and nature, and usually on a tripod....but I would love to hand hold more and still get a sharp image. I crop ALOT. I rarely use 3:2 aspect ratio. I shoot in bad weather (rain, snow) and dusty conditions. I switch very frequently between landscape and portrait (my L-bracket is my best friend) and I only use the screen - no EVF. My Canon concerns: 1. The biggest draw for me to Sony is the megapixels for cropping. Since I will crop most of my images just for aspect ratio.....is the Canon not a good choice for me? Or am I underestimating what 45 MP can do? 2. Is the flip screen going to be more annoying to deal with the L-bracket? I've found at least 1 L-bracket that will allow for full use of the flip screen either horizontally and vertically but it seems it will take a lot of maneuvering to switch back and forth. I always thought I wanted a flip screen but now I am questioning this. The Canon advantages seem to be: -Better IBIS? Substantially better than Sony? How would it compare to my Panasonic IBIS with native lenses? -Many people mention Canon has better color, if I always shoot in raw....dumb questions...how is color better or worse? -Weather sealing? Thanks so much!! Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more (unknown member) • Regular Member • Posts: 217 A7RIV getting old and long in the tooth. 2 I can't count how many times I've read, "wait for the A7R V" in these forums. The A7Riv uses Sony's old CPU and suffers from many restrictions because of it. It doesn't have Sony's best AF, it can only shoot 8 bit video, it is limited to 10 FPS. There are other problems too. It has a very slow sensor read out speed, usually only 1/10th of a second (but can increase to 1/15th). These are very slow and cause bad rolling shutter in electronic shutter mode and video. IBIS is not near as good either, and if you shoot video its no contest. The best A7R iv video is about the same as the R5's worst (4K line skipped which the R5 can shoot unlimited). I'll stop there because the A7Riv is still a decent camera, but it is slow and getting dated. Meanwhile the R5 does everything better/faster, including AF. And the R5 is still getting FW updates. The A7Riv will likely get nothing more that bug fixes. Re: A7RIV getting old and long in the tooth. I've been trying to wait for the A7r5, but I broke my current camera so I don't want to wait anymore. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more (unknown member) • Regular Member • Posts: 217 Re: A7RIV getting old and long in the tooth. 1
Well the rumors are the A7Rv won't be out for a year now. The APSC camera was delayed at least 3 months and the A7iv is going to be delayed even longer. The A7Rv won't come out until long after that. I've read late 2022 to early 2023 now. That's why they released the A7Riv-A. That is the new model to last a couple years. Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV 3
People tend to be under the misapprehension that the color produced by a camera depends only upon JPEG encoding and, therefore, shooting RAW means you bypass any camera imposed color issues. Or they may be under the impression that if you have a RAW file that any color corrections can be done easily so that an image from one camera is exactly the same as an image from another camera. Neither of these perceptions have any basis in reality. The camera sensor and the bayer filter placed over it are primarily responsible for how color is reproduced. Yeah, color profiles are a thing and they can be applied to the JPEG or in post, but they are designed around how the camera captures the raw data. And sure, corrections can be made after the fact with some amount of success, but even using a color profiling tool while shooting, which is a serious pain in the but for everything but commercial work, will only do so much to fix things like skin tone or minor variations in various colors. All one has to do is check out color gamut testing of sensors to quickly realize that if a sensor has a color gamut that it's not going to match from one camera to another, and colors within that gamut are always skewed from their ideal values. Anyway, I believe that Canon tends to have slightly less color accuracy than some Sony sensors, but it is skewed in a direction that more people find more pleasing.....which implies they've done this one purpose.
LesT • Regular Member • Posts: 483 Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV 1
You crop alot...low light...nature... different weather conditions. You just spoke of me exactly. The high resolution allows cropping that much more and, in fact, there is even a switch to crop in-camera which is wonderful when you set it up for a button that can be switched quickly. Low light, nature, different weather conditions... This camera lets you stretch that much more and shots you never thought you could get before...are wonderful now. Took this early this morning... I could never have pulled off this sharp of an iso 10K shot hand held before the R5... Canon EOS R5 Canon EF 28-300mm f/3.5-5.6L IS USM Canon EF 16-35mm F4L IS USM Canon RF 24-105mm F4L IS USM Canon RF 24-240mm F4-6.3 +2 more dgumshu • Veteran Member • Posts: 4,621 Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV
I almost bought an A7R IV before the R5 was released. My biggest concern with the Sony is the HUGE file size for every image. On a shoot I take thousands of images and if each file is 100+MB, that will make for a very tedious culling session... every time. No thanks. If you’re into landscapes, it should not affect you as much.
Canon EOS-1D X Canon EOS 5DS R Canon EOS 5D Mark IV Canon EOS R5 OM-1 +52 more Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV Thanks! I figured there was more to it than my limited understanding. I appreciate your explanation. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV In reply to LesT • Jul 24, 2021 Nice!! I can't imagine anything but grain if I shoot at that ISO with my current camera. It is very confusing (for me) to sort out all of these great features of the R5, yet there are statements that the image quality of the A7RIV is better. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV In reply to dgumshu • Jul 24, 2021 I am slightly concerned about file size. I take way to many pictures for a landscape and nature photographer....but I understand it is still probably way less than wildlife or sports. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more CameraCarl • Veteran Member • Posts: 8,749 Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV A key question that I didn't see discussed here is: can you get the lenses you need? Many of the Canon RF lenses are backordered and some, such as the RF 100-500, probably have a month (or more) long waiting list most places. You can, of course, use adapted EF lenses, but if you are buying into a brand new system, why accept any compromises (even as good as the adapted EF lenses are)? MjMac • Forum Member • Posts: 77 Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV
I've had some bad luck with Sony and weather sealing. While it has dramatically improved over the A7RIII, and I've seen people use the RIV in all kinds of conditions, I still prefer the long term reliability and proven track record of Canon.
Sony also has pixel shift that creates 241 megapixel images if you want more MP and even larger files.
I haven't had any problems using the 3 Legged Thing L Bracket for the R5
The IBIS is very good on the Canon. Some people claim 3-5 stops on the R5 with an unstabilized lens and 6-7 stops with a stabilized lens and 1-3 stops on the A7RIV.
This is subjective.
See above.
One additional thing to consider is the available glass in both systems. Sony has a substantial lead in native lenses. Canon is catching up, but with the vast shortages and supply chain issues over the last 18 months it's going to take awhile for Canon to keep up with supply and demand. Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV I was about to look at lens availability, since I had read a few concerns about it. 100-500 would be an important lens for me. While it isn't an emergency to get it, I do have some trips coming up at the end of the year and would love to practice with the new camera before I am (hopefully) traveling. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV In reply to MjMac • Jul 24, 2021 Thanks! Regarding "wanting" bigger files sizes....I just want enough to crop and maintain a good quality image. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more (unknown member) • Regular Member • Posts: 217 R5 and ANY camera takes hi res photos Sony hi resolution photo mode is a marketing gimmick. ANY camera can create super resolution photos like Sony markets (take multiple photos, export, and combine manually with software). There are many articles on how to do this. https://petapixel.com/2015/02/21/a-practical-guide-to-creating-superresolution-photos-with-photoshop/ Sony uses arguably a worse option since it limit the number of of photos and uses proprietary software making it difficult to adjust to taste. Obviously, the in camera solution used by Panasonic and Olympus is superior. It creates hi res RAW files automatically that reviews say are more detailed that what you get after all the extra work with Sony's solution. Anyway, if you want hi res or super resolution photos, ANY camera can do it, (unknown member) • Regular Member • Posts: 217 Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV 1
Check all the review sites and comparisons. The A7Riv is no better. I think some Sony owners like to say it because they have no other advantage, even though its not true in real life. Often because of the worse stabilization the A7Riv image have less detail and lower IQ. Photos still look sharp and decent, but just not quite as good as R5 photos. Obviously R5 colors are going to more pleasing and easier to work with too. SOOC (straight out of camera) picture will usually look a lot better with the R5 too. The R5 is simply a better all around camera that does a lot more. It has focus bracketing and other features Sony does not offer. It has better IBIS and far better video. It has better ergonomics with a larger LCD, top LCD, better grip, etc. Its faster in every way including more frames per second. I could go on and on, but its really no contest. This site picked the R5 over the A7Riv for best camera in the price range, and so does every review site I've seen. Re: R5 and ANY camera takes hi res photos I never considered or really knew about creating a super high res image. Since I crop a lot, I was initially attracted to the 61 MP to have more flexibility with that. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV
I initially didn't really care about the IBIS because I use a tripod the VAST majority of the time (even though my current set up has great IBIS). However, I am starting to think that I might enjoy that aspect of not pulling out the tripod so much. Isn't the dynamic range supposed to be not as great? And sharpness? Sorry if these are noob questions....I am definitely an advanced beginner. Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7R IVA Panasonic Lumix G Vario 7-14mm F4 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-150mm F4-5.6 ASPH Mega OIS +10 more (unknown member) • Regular Member • Posts: 217 Re: R5 and ANY camera takes hi res photos
The best part is to create super resolution photos you shoot hand held. No tripod. But like I said, you won;t get full resolution with the A7Riv very often. Lenses from both systems don't always resolve that much and Sony's IS doesn't work as well as IS on other cameras. Also, often you can't shoot with the electronic shutter with the A7Riv without rolling shutter. And you get some shutter shock with mechanical shutter which kills resolution. It seems strange, but you get more detail usually with the R5. axlotl • Senior Member • Posts: 2,252 Re: Camera upgrade question...R5 vs A7RIV 2
I hand hold landscapes with the R5 all the time with very sharp results. In fact I only use a tripod at night or dawn/dusk.
The R5 can tolerate heavy cropping and still deliver good sharp pix.
The usual rule of thumb given for resolution comparisons is that camera A needs to have a linear resolution of at least 1.2x that of camera B for any significant difference to be perceptible in photos. 61 Mpx gives 1.16x the linear resolution of 45 Mpx. So given the same senor dimensions and equally very sharp lenses the resolution advantage of the A7R4 is insignificant. In practice many other factors will be more important like lens quality, camera/subject movement etcetera.... You will need to be selective with lens choices in either system to get the most from the high pixel count sensors.
The fully articulated screen on the Canon is a huge advantage especially with portrait prientation photos or vlogging.
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Canon R5 vs Sony A7riv DPReview
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